oselle: (Default)
[personal profile] oselle
Please watch this. I know it's long but please watch the whole thing.



I am so glad this video exists because this woman is the face of everyday American conservatism. Is she a "bad" person? No, I'm sure she's not. She seems perfectly pleasant. She's probably nice to her friends and good to her family. No doubt about it. She's also dumber than paint.

Yesterday she was in such a state of despair over the End of America As We Know It that she was passionately weeping at a town hall meeting. Today, stripped of canned talking points about "socialism" and "Russia" she doesn't seem to know much about...anything. She doesn't know her own household income. She doesn't know that Medicare and Social Security are essentially socialist programs. Her only awareness of current events up until now was of the rockets on TV during the first Gulf War. She thinks that a $5,000 out-of-pocket deductible on her family's health insurance is a good thing. She acknowledges that there are needy people out there, but thinks it would be best for them to rely on charity -- and has some sort of muddled notion that this is what the "founding fathers" wanted for America.

She says only one thing in this interview that makes sense and is demonstrably true: "Maybe I'm just not that smart."

Hold onto that thought, honey. Go with it. Really let it sink in. And maybe when it does, you'll think twice before you show up at a town hall meeting spouting off about things that you clearly don't know anything, anything about and trying to drag the country down to third-world status with your goddamned, laughable, disgraceful ignorance.

Date: 2009-08-14 02:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oxer12.livejournal.com
I don't know if I can watch. Seeing people like her always makes me squirm, because I actually feel BAD for them. It's like watching the clueless in "Borat" get duped. I couldn't watch that either.

Your summary is enough to make me feel the squirminess commencing. Ahh, ignorance...
Edited Date: 2009-08-14 02:36 am (UTC)

Date: 2009-08-14 02:43 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
I was squirming too because she really is so pathetic but at the same time...she deserves to be mocked from coast to coast and around the world. She isn't a hapless innocent who got duped by some city slicker into making a fool of herself on national television. She's a dangerous ignoramus who is one among millions of such people preventing this country from moving forward instead of backwards. And you really should watch it. Lawrence O'Donnell is actually very kind to her -- he doesn't make her squirm, she gets there all on her own. Frankly I think O'Donnell was completely dumbfounded.

Date: 2009-08-14 02:46 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oxer12.livejournal.com
Oh, don't get me wrong, I agree with the mocking. It's just hard to watch. But you've talked me into it. Will report back...

OK, I watched it. Wow. She really has NO CLUE what she's talking about. I'm shocked at how many people screeching about "no government healthcare" don't realize that that's exactly what Medicare IS. If this chick is indicative of the average protester (and sadly, I think she probably is), then this debate is scarier than I thought.
Edited Date: 2009-08-14 03:01 am (UTC)

Date: 2009-08-14 04:29 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
The debate is MUCH scarier than you thought. The average protester (by my observation) is actually a lot angrier and more violent than Katy Abram. Abram went for the waterworks, but an awful lot of her fellow "patriots" are packing heat.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:19 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mara-snh.livejournal.com
Oh God, yeah. I caught this earlier on Crooks & Liars. It's hideous, isn't it? But after just having finished reading "American Fascists" and having a better understanding now of the far-right Christian dominionists, I think we've spotted one of their clueless sheep. Note the gold cross at the base of her throat, at once discreet and prominent. Note her statement about how her husband takes care of the bills, her, everything. Tee hee. She either doesn't know, or has been told not to reveal, the family income. Her understanding of the Constitution is worse than rudimentary -- she is mouthing the mindless mantras of "tradition." She shows no intellectual depth at all; in fact, she appears to have zero critical thinking skills. She is the perfect wife and mother to shill for the Christian Reich. God help her. I don't intend to. I'm tired of putting up with this moronic crap.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:46 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Yeah, I caught that bit about how her husband takes all of that stuff, no to mention the weird little-girl way she said it. It's easy to take potshots at something like that but frankly, if she wants to be infantile and ignorant and have a husband who's more of a daddy, that's her choice. I don't care. I'm a huge believer in people living life the way they want to but I sure as hell have a problem with people taking that ignorance out into the public sphere and fucking up the country with it. And I'd love to know why this housewife and mom is gallivanting around at town hall meetings instead of at home taking care of her family where she belongs.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:57 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mara-snh.livejournal.com
This woman actually represents the ideal of a certain class of right-wingnut Christian activist. The image she projects of infantile subjugation to her husband as Godlike master of his family, the mindless trust in his caretaking authority -- so like that of the church -- is exactly what made her somebody's choice to be their spokesperson. Millions of slavish conservative women will either recognize themselves in her or get the message that they are supposed to find her worthy of emulation. ("Gee, she got a rich man to take care of her AND she got to be on TV! Whatever she's doing, it's working! I'll try to be more like that.") She didn't surface by accident, any more than did that Ron Paul guy in NH with the gun strapped to his leg and the "time to water liberty" sign.

Date: 2009-08-14 04:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
I find it kind of astounding that someone so empty-headed could even get teary at that meeting. She clearly has NO idea what she's talking about and is just repeating things that others (most likely her husband and Glenn Beck) have said to her. It's downright creepy to witness. You expect her to pull off her face and reveal that she's nothing but a Stepford robot.

Date: 2009-08-14 04:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mara-snh.livejournal.com
She is a victim of far-right Christian fear-mongering. Their form of brainwashing begins with birth (or re-birth, as the case may be) and hounds them to the grave. Your Stepford analogy isn't far off. This woman has been trained to believe that she doesn't have to think; her "leaders" (pastor, father, husband, Glenn Beck) have done that for her. My pity for such victims does not extend to tolerating them. They must be called out and challenged, lest thoughtful people be swayed by their ravings into thinking they might have some kind of rational point. The liberals of Germany made the mistake of tolerating the Deutsche Christen Church when it began reconstructing Christian doctrine to make it seen that Nazism was a natural expression of its "traditional values." By the time they caught on, it was too late. I'm not saying this woman is a latter-day Aryan apologist. She is too ignorant to understand how she is being used. But as I said, that doesn't mean I'm willing to cut her any slack. She is dangerous.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vshendria.livejournal.com
Oh, my god but she is stupid. Stupid and ignorant.

"I wasn't paying attention to politics because I was busy being a wife and mother."

I will withhold my comments on that one.

"I don't want our country to become like Russia."

Seriously, WTF? How can anyone possibly think this? How? I can't even begin to wrap my head around the not-knowingness.

But here is my favorite:

"We need to return the country to what the founders intended..."

Oh, so we should bring slavery back?
And when she starts into the bit about people looking after each other. Hello? THAT IS WHAT TAXATION IS FOR. Why is it that "looking after each other" is okay as long as you can pick one nice, deserving white family down the street and not a have your help distributed according to some more generic understanding of need? Because that is what this is really about. It is about race and class and who you think deserves your help. But you don't want to admit your a bigot so you turn it into a story about how they aren't "deserving."

And if you have such a beef with your taxes, lady, then stop serving up more tax cuts for the rich by voting Republican!

*pants* I swear, I can't hack politics. It's going to kill me.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:56 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
I don't want our country to become like Russia.

This in particular was such pure, senseless blather that it was almost breathtaking. What year is this? Is the Cold War still on? Do you think she even knows what the Cold War was?

so we should bring slavery back?

And repeal women's suffrage. Not that she would know what "suffrage" means. But then again, this chick not being able to vote would probably be a good thing for America.

And when she starts into the bit about people looking after each other. Hello? THAT IS WHAT TAXATION IS FOR.

No, no, no, silly! She means people should voluntarily look out for each other when their heart moves them to the occasional charitable donation, not TAXES. The former is patriotic and Christian and the latter is EVIL SOCIALISM. People should only ever help others when they feel like it and those who need help should be forced to grovel for it and be grateful for the crumbs of charity that may occasionally fall from the munificent table of those whom God has favored. That is, of course, what the founders intended.

Date: 2009-08-14 03:44 am (UTC)
ext_6866: (Huffy)
From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com
There was so much in this that made me want to weep--but I really hated her trying to frame the end by blathering about how her friend on the "other end of the political spectrum" thinks she's "naive" for thinking people help each other. As if it's good ole folks like her that have the values that make health insurance unnecessary. When her whole point starts with how she feels like somebody might raise her taxes just so someone else can get healthcare.

So basically she just wants to be able to decide who is worthy of her help (like a death panel). She'll pay for her family and maybe a neighbor--at least she imagines she will. Imagine paying thousands of dollars every year to your neighbor with a serious illness? But people without family or friends won't be missed anyway so they can die.

Funny thing is I didn't want to yell at her or even mock her after the interview. I wanted to sit her down in a room and really press her on everything she was saying.

And probably get her away from her husband. Because I just feel like he's telling her what to say. When he's not paying their bills. (Honestly, lady, you claim you're upset about your taxes being raised but have no idea how much money you make to begin with and so whether you'll be affected?)

Date: 2009-08-14 04:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
As if it's good ole folks like her that have the values that make health insurance unnecessary.

The deranged notion that charity is better than a genuine social safety net is probably one of the most viciously repellent "values" held by conservatives. You're right -- it gives people like Katy Abram the right to decide who "deserves" help (and just how much) and it forces the needy into a life of indignity and begging. May God truly have mercy upon anyone dependent upon the charity of a Katy Abram, who probably donates a few cans from the back of her pantry to the annual Thanksgiving food drive and thinks she's fulfilled her goodness quota for the year (there are a number of studies that show that Republican areas tend to have far lower rates of charitable contributions than Democratic ones -- LOL!)

And you know what, even if she (or rather, her husband, since he handles all the money in the household) is extraordinarily generous...are they generous enough to cover someone's chemotherapy? Or a lifetime of diabetes treatment? Of course not. And if she's such a believer in people helping each other then why are her parents going on Medicare? Shouldn't she be taking them in and covering their medical expenses...like "the founders" intended?

I'd love to press her on stuff like this too, but there'd just be no point in pressing this woman on anything. Lawrence O'Donnell tried to do it and she just got more and more confused because she has no real thoughts in her head. At least she didn't get belligerent, that's about the best thing I can say for her.

Date: 2009-08-14 02:14 pm (UTC)
ext_6866: (Default)
From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com
I remember reading a thing--that didn't surprise me--that Americans in general have a totally exaggerated view of their own charity. Like they totally think that America as a country "gives" more than anybody else on earth to help unfortunate countries, and we as a country are actually very stingy. With certain types of people--like this woman, I suspect--any little donation they feel they deserve a ton of credit for. The people who give regularly just do it without any big song and dance about charity.

Date: 2009-08-14 02:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Absolutely. Americans in general are less generous than citizens of other countries, and they are particularly cheap in those Christian Red States. I'm not sure how America ranks as a nation but I think if you adjust for the overall size of our economy, we are pretty much on a par with other countries in terms of giving.

Americans have an exaggerated view of themselves, period. This delusion of superiority is crippling this country. I am really getting quite sick of it.

Date: 2009-08-17 10:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cs-luis.livejournal.com
The deranged notion that charity is better than a genuine social safety net is probably one of the most viciously repellent "values" held by conservatives. You're right -- it gives people like Katy Abram the right to decide who "deserves" help (and just how much) and it forces the needy into a life of indignity and begging.

God, this is so true, and an attitude I've had to combat to a conservative friend of mine. Thanks for putting it in these words, it's helpful.

Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 12:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] llinos.livejournal.com
That is just so sad!

I've been to Russia – I doubt she has – it's actually not that bad. Lol! Certainly no one there ever has to worry about being able to afford a doctor!

Consider this – for the most part the Communist USSR was controlled by propaganda. I had one of those all night intense conversations with my Intourist guide, a very intelligent lady called Iraina. She told me that one of the biggest shocks of her life was to discover, at about the age of 13, that all her life the Government had been lying to her. The Russians were given the impression, she told me, that the West was starving, that we were poor and corrupt beyond belief and that our collapse was imminent.

With the advent of Peristroika, the internet and a relaxation on tourism, the Russian people began to discover that everything they believed about the West were lies, invented to keep them content with their lot.

This was back in 1987, and things had started to change.

I also visited Prague more recently, another former Communist country. People there were certainly improving their standards of living, now that they knew how the West lived and, quite honestly, I would be just as comfortable living in such a country now as I am living in the UK.

Many Americans seem to equate the words "Russia" and "Communism" with "Evil" and use them as the ultimate putdown.

However, look at the propaganda and devices currently being used in the USA to keep people subjugated.

How many Americans have passports? How many have ever left the country? How much annual holiday do they get to ENABLE them to travel? If they want to travel, do they have the resources to pay for it? How can they compare themselves to the rest of the world if they never see it?

There are so many insidious ways that I hear anti-Rest of the World propaganda spouting from the mouths of Americans.

They think our food is inedible! In a documentary I heard an American girl claim that we (the Brits) served squirrel and chipmunk. We don't even have chipmunks in this country!! And we certainly don't eat squirrel – or anything else disgusting. I've heard nonsense like "Steak and Blood pudding"! What the hell is that?

In fictional programmes, even the Simpsons, nonsense and lies all the time. I remember one in particular from Sabrina the Teenage Witch: "You know what it's like trying to buy a swimsuit in London?"

Yes I do! It's very easy – there are a lot of excellent shops in London! What crap was that?

There is nothing I could buy in America that I couldn't buy here – but much that I can buy here that I can't get in America!

But you are fed this nonsense all the time!

Wake up Americans! The Rest of the World is just as good as you and in many respects a lot better! Travel, take a look – then decide.

You are actually being treated in very much the same way that Communist USSR treated its people during the Cold War and the sooner Americans start to see that the better for them.

But seeing women like this (sigh!) I doubt it's going to happen.

Thank Eru for you enlightened souls! Please, please keep spreading the word.

Sorry for the long rant, but seriously, I'd be interested to hear any "horror" stories you have about life in Europe – perhaps I can help to put the record straight – or not as the case may be.

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Please understand that Katy Abram's reference to Russia doesn't mean anything at all. The only reason she mentioned "Russia" is because "Russia" has been the boogeyman over here for some sixty years, even though it's not even Communist anymore -- which I doubt that Katy Abram knows. I would bet you good money that Katy Abram could not even find Russia on a map much less tell you anything at all about it. In her mind, "Russia" is just a sort of all-purpose synonym for "everything that's wrong with the world."

Frankly there are Americans here who genuinely think the whole rest of the world is a toilet. Travel might change their minds but it probably would not because they are too indoctrinated into a fantasy they call "the American way of life" which is not anything real but just a soupy, red-white-and-blue montage of images -- waving flags, big cars, cowboys, soldiers, the Fourth of July, hot dogs, NASCAR, white people, Jesus, Texas and just generally "kickin' ass!" See, the problem with you English (and everyone else) is that you're just not ass-kickin' like us. You've got your fruity little country over there and you all dress funny and talk funny and drive faggy little putt-putt cars and shell out all your money in taxes so the government can "take care of you" like a big bunch of titty babies who need their mommies. Over here, we don't need that shit cuz WE'RE KICKIN' ASS! Plus JESUS and FREEDOM and I'M THE NRA AND I VOTE!

I realize the above comment sounds incoherent. It is. Very. But believe me, I've lived here all my life and I know that deep down, this is the mindset that keeps so many Americans from seeing what other countries are doing right and what we're doing wrong.

I do however, have to defend The Simpsons. When they seem to be mocking other countries, they're really mocking American prejudices about other countries, usually in a dead-on and painfully honest way. As Homer Simpson once said about Canada, "Pfft, why would I want to leave America to go to 'America-Lite'?" :)

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] llinos.livejournal.com
I too will defend the Simpsons - it's one of the most popular programmes here and, in fairness, they knock the US as much as anywhere else.

What worries me are the insidious little bits that you and I know are irony but the average Yank might take to be gospel.

They know that the jibes at their own country are not always to be taken literally, but what scares me is that, because of an overwhelming ignorance about the Rest-of-the-World, do they take jibes about other countries in the same way or does it just reinforce existing prejudices?

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:32 pm (UTC)
ext_6866: (At home)
From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com
People believing the most outlandish horror stories are probably complicit in their own ignorance, I'd bet. I mean, in fictional programs, a lot of them are jokes on American ignorance rather than actual ignorance--even if a lot of people probably don't get that. Like, it's not like the creators of The Simpsons haven't been to England, watched a lot of English shows. When they do shows where the Simpsons travel it's an intentional parody. You're getting the British version of Cletus, the slack-jawed yokel. And sometimes it is funny--last week on True Blood a dim-witted character, when told at his evangelical camp that good always overcomes evil, replied, "Yeah? Then explain to me Europe." I doubt he even knew what he meant, but it was exactly what he would say.

But still, there are a lot of people who have never left the country and any impression they have about other countries is second or third hand. I suspect a lot of it out of date. Okay, I've no idea where anybody would ever come up with people eating chipmunk or squirrel in England (people do eat/have eaten squirrel in the US, actually).

What's the most embarassing to me is not just the people are ignorant about other countries they've never been to, but that it's this condescending ignorance that assumes that everyone else in the world is looking up to the US. I wouldn't have believed this attitude actually existed if I wasn't on the internet and regularly heard Americans earnestly speaking this way--and when called on it defend their attitude! As I think Bill Maher said, the whole "best country in the world" thing is like saying you have the "best grandma in the world." It's a nice thing to say to express affection but you're not supposed to literally mean it, like you think other people wish they could trade their grandmother for yours!

But unfortunately, to the aggressively jingoistic people, suggestions that they should get to know the rest of the world are met with hostility. You must be stuck up to want to go somewhere else. (With implied class issues as well--you must just be a rich elite person if you have a passport.)

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:42 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
With implied class issues as well--you must just be a rich elite person if you have a passport.

Wasn't it the magnificent Sarah Palin herself who dismissed the fact that she'd never left the country as proof of her non-elitism? As in, My folks didn't have money to send me on any fancy backpackin round Europe! sort of thing?

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 03:22 pm (UTC)
ext_6866: (Cousins)
From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com
I do remember that. I think that's almost exactly what she said.

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] llinos.livejournal.com
My son works for an American company and occassionally has to travel to San Diego for work-related stuff.

When there, several co-workers suggested to him if he "played his cards right" he could get a permanent transfer to the States.

His reaction, "Why on earth would I want to do that?"

I have hosted quite a few Americans in my time, and many start with this strange attitude of "Only in America" and "Don't you wish you lived in the 'Best country in the World?'"

After a few days they stop it.

It would be brilliant if more American youngsters were encouraged to take a gap year and travel around Europe - you know - before it's too late to change the mindset.

We should start an exchange programme - now wouldn't that be good. You got any teenagers you'd like me to have for a while?

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:51 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
My company is owned by Canadians and while it profits them to do business here I don't know one of them who has ever thought that this is a better place to live. I know three Canadians who have packed up and gone home after just a few years, in one case specifically citing the lack of available healthcare -- this was a young woman who did not have any serious health issues, and yet she said what "finally did it" for her was having to shell out $250 for an antibiotic while she was working freelance and had no insurance.

LOL, I have no teenagers but if you keep saying stuff like that you could possibly wind up hosting ME!

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] llinos.livejournal.com
LOL, I have no teenagers but if you keep saying stuff like that you could possibly wind up hosting ME!

And you'd be very welcome - seriously!

Lesley (MarigoldG) and I are always happy to play host to you guys! We're only 20 mins from Heathrow.

GW and Pippinfan are due here in a week's time!

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-14 03:36 pm (UTC)
ext_6866: (At home)
From: [identity profile] sistermagpie.livejournal.com
The real problem is that there are a lot of students who do that. Unfortunately that attitude is fostered on the one side of the culture war they're against. It all goes together--being liberal, wanting healthcare, sex education, too much education, travel and interest in the rest of the world--see, that just leads to "apologizing for America" (iow, seeing America as just one country out of many, no better than anywhere else, and with things we could learn from others).

I remember when I was doing a year in England the healthcare floored me. I broke out in hives randomly and went to the doctor. I never got over the ability to go to a doctor who was great and took care of me without then having a big bill.

It's like a self-perpetuating ignorance. Not only do they have no clue, they don't know they have no clue. Your average British person, for instance, whether they seek out anything about the US or not is going to be bombarded with stuff. While unfortunately it's all too easy to live in the US and completely cut yourself off so that other countries only become rumors. (As do plenty of areas of their own country!)

Re: Russia = Evil! Really?

Date: 2009-08-15 03:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Not only do they have no clue, they don't know they have no clue.

Oh, it's much worse than that...it's not that they don't know they have no clue, they actually think they have all the clues, and that all the rest of us are delusional or deliberate liars. Almost every single time I've gotten into a scrap with some conservative, they make a point of telling me how "well informed" they are. The last one who did so sent me a bunch of links of her sources, and as you'd expect they were almost all conservative outlets, from mainstream ones like the Wall Street Journal to the real fringe like WorldNetDaily. And of course, Fox News.

A week or so ago, Bill O'Reilly had a report about legalizing marijuana, and hosted some "expert" who claimed that Amsterdam was "a cesspool" of crime and corruption. Someone in Amsterdam posted a YouTube video of Amsterdam which is, of course, lovely, and also superimposed a number of statistics proving that Holland has a much lower crime rate, lower murder rate, fewer young people who had ever even tried pot, etc. But the people who watch Bill O'Reilly will never see that video...so they will run around convinced that they are very well informed that Amsterdam is a "cesspool" so we must never, ever legalize pot. AAAAAAARGH. Would a trip to Amsterdam change their minds? Who even knows. When someone is that far gone, can their mind even change? Do they have a mind?

Date: 2009-08-14 02:24 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Hmm, I can't access that page...

Date: 2009-08-14 02:28 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ladymirth.livejournal.com
So sorry, I didn't see it was flocked.

Here, this is open: http://almostwitty.livejournal.com/337084.html

Date: 2009-08-14 02:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
LOL, I love the bit about Stephen Hawking although the reality that he is somehow both British and alive is merely an inconvenient "fact" to many Americans who will cheerfully dismiss it as socialist propaganda. LOL!

Truth from today's Times

Date: 2009-08-14 03:26 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] llinos.livejournal.com
Here's a link you might find useful. I have to go out now so no time to put it up myself - but it's from The Times - the paper my husband worked for for 35 years and probably the most truthful and objective newspaper in the world.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6795466.ece

Re: Truth from today's Times

Date: 2009-08-15 02:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Yes, these women were also profiled on tonight's BBC America News. If they'd done a little research into the "grassroots" organization that was producing that non-existant documentary, they would have found out exactly who supports them and would have realized exactly how their stories would have been used. A conservative or Republican here will say that it doesn't matter because their stories are still true...they were still failed by the NHS. But seriously, so what? You could ask just about anyone here in the U.S. and they'd have or know someone who had a story like this and yet the right-wing tells us our system is the best in the world! But it's just so typical that people will get freaked out about these two British ladies and ignore the constant suffering in their own backyard.

And the irony is that these women are dedicated not to abolishing the NHS but actually to expanding it and getting even more funding for it. The best thing they could do would be to film another commercial explaining the truth, because not that many people here read the Times or watch BBC.

And what about than Daniel Hannan? Why is he over here trashing the NHS all over our conservative news outlets? Don't we have enough of our own nutcases? At least the leader of his own party had the sense to dismiss him as "an eccentric" but you folks over in the UK had still better watch out if you've got Daniel Hannans in your midst or else you may one day find yourself as screwed as we are.

Date: 2009-08-14 04:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sixth-queen.livejournal.com
Hey Oselle, check out this Diary at DailyKos:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/8/13/766517/-Katy-Abram-is-a-9-12-Organizer-(Updated)

Apparently our friend Amy joined some kind of conservative meet-up in DECEMBER 2006, and began sending out emails to host 9-12 parties in her home in Lebanon, Pennsylvania in MAY 2009.

"9-12" is Glenn Beck's crazy-ass manifesto about the values we Americans should have. (9-12 is a reference to the day after 9-11). She's been a Beckbot for at least 2 1/2 YEARS. The only thing that woke her up was the Election of 2006. Does this count as "just waking up?"

But yeah, she's still dumb as paint.

Date: 2009-08-15 03:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
I find it even more depressing or perhaps hilarious that Katy Abram is not just some random everywoman but is actually a dedicated activist -- and is still so incoherent about her own beliefs. But that's probably because it's difficult to be coherent about beliefs that amount to nothing more than a mashup of Glenn Beck episodes. When is the Rapture gonna come and deliver us from these clowns?

Date: 2009-08-14 05:27 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] juliebeth.livejournal.com
Reading about all this makes me really reluctant to return to my own country. I frequently find myself apologizing for being American. *sigh*

Date: 2009-08-14 08:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sixth-queen.livejournal.com
Don't feel too bad. Just remember this:

1. Obama beat McCain with more votes than Bush beat Gore AND Kerry combined.
2. Even with all their cheating and $$$, the Republicans could only muster a very slim majority. Dems only needed to sway a small part of the population to take over. That was what happened in 2006. Rove's talk of Permanent Republican Majority was silly.
3. The "liberal media" that supposedly is "in the tank" for Obama is anything but. American TV is onwed by corporations which love juicy tax breaks and outsourcing. Media are biased toward conservatism. The token liberals on TV are only there for the ratings too.
4. If all else fails, demographics are on the side of Dems. They don't hate blacks, gays, and are not blindly religious.
5. These heat-packing Palin-lovin' dittobots are fewer than one would think. They just get a lot of attention. I wouldn't worry.

Just wait until Obama gets health care through. 20 years from now Katy Abram will be screaming "Keep the government out of my public option!"

Date: 2009-08-15 03:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
Yeah, but so what? The Republicans still have enough influence (through their dittobots and their controlled media) to influence the debate. They watered down the stimulus bill and now they're doing the same with healthcare reform. And while the pistol-packin' Palinettes may be few in number, there are an awful lot of fence-sitters who are very, very easily swayed by biased news. Obama beat McCain only because things were SO FUCKING HORRIBLE after 8 years of Republican rule but I think a lot of people, those fence-sitters in particular, are already starting to forget about the past 8 years, or I should say, that history is already being cleansed from the national consciousness. In 20 years we'll be naming airports after George W. Bush, that's what.

Date: 2009-08-15 03:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oselle.livejournal.com
I just think the rest of the civilized world must look upon us with a mix of horror and fascination. We've become the world's sideshow.

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