oselle | SPN 6:05 II

I know it'll never happen, but I'd love to imagine that SPN is going to provide some REAL explanation of why Sam let Dean remain ignorant of his escape from hell for a whole year. Because given Sam's recent behavior, it's completely impossible to believe that he wanted Dean to be happy.

Whatever's wrong with Sam (if he's actually Sam), this is clearly not a guy who's concerned with Dean's happiness. Hell, he's not even concerned with Dean's survival...nor does he give a shit about Dean's little nuclear family since he was more than willing to take the risk that a vamped-up Dean might head for Casa Braeden and slaughter both Lisa and Ben. We're only five episodes into the season and they've already destroyed one of the season's foundations -- the idea that Sam wanted Dean to have a normal life. So it would be great if we found out why Sam really let Dean languish in grief-stricken ignorance for a whole year...but I know we won't. The writers are just fine with the "Sam wanted Dean to be happy" story and they won't see any need to amend it in spite of recent events.

It'll be interesting to see how Bobby reacts next week when he finds out what Sam did to Dean. I hope Dean doesn't soft-pedal it, because Sam did more than just watch Dean get turned. He deliberately allowed Dean to get turned and then he stood around and coolly observed his brother's suffering with detached scientific curiosity. Then he sent him into a lair of vampires to scope out intel. And then he pumped him for information before administering an antidote just in case that antidote killed him (a possibility that neither Sam nor Gramps looked too concerned about). So I'd better not hear Dean tell Bobby only that Sam "watched me get turned" and BOY, I'd better not hear Bobby tell Dean that he must have imagined it because Sam's such a good kid and it's time for Dean to quit pissing and moaning about him.

They've gone so far past a scenario where anyone could stand up for Sam or justify what he's done. It's SO beyond "I don't know, Bobby, Sam's different." Sam is not "different." He's a sick motherfucker. He's a guy who would drown puppies in the bathtub to see how long it would take them to stop kicking. What will they blame it on this time? Possession? Demon blood? No soul? Dean's "bossiness?" If they want to go any of those routes they'll have to scrap the whole "Sam wanted Dean to be happy" shit. But you know they won't.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

That was one of my first questions after seeing this episode. I don't think that thing is Sam. Sorry, as much as I want to see a re-enactment of Mice and Men I don't think TPTB will go there. However, if it is Sam I can't think of how they can really fix the relationship.

If that thing isn't really Sam then for crying out loud, I sure hope someone besides Dean (and the audience) notices.

This is why it's always so funny when they have Bobby complain about the boys bitching about each other. That usually, at least when Dean is worried about Sam's behavior, it's because he's understandable worried that he might be the Prince of Darkness now.

Yes, exactly. Is Bobby going to tell Dean to "sack up" again? Is Dean once again going to stand there looking contrite and wondering if he's being too hard on poor Sammy?

Edited 2010-10-23 21:26 (UTC)

I'm on the "that thing ain't Sam" bandwagon at this point, too. I have to admit, I was genuinely creeped out by that little smile from Sam as he stood there and watched his brother get turned into a vampire. Ew. But yeah, agree with your earlier post that they better not handwave this away with their usual disregard for, oh, everything.

Jim Beaver was a guest star on this week's episode of The Mentalist (he played a racehorse trainer), and all I could think was, "Oooh, Bobby's undercover! Wonder what he's hunting?" :D

I was pretty grossed out by the little smile and I actually got the impression that Sam had been hoping this would happen. Of course, this isn't the first time we've seen Sam be apathetic about Dean's well-being (think "Yellow Fever") but they really went too far this time. He literally didn't give a shit about what had happened to Dean, it was all some science experiment to him. If Dean had taken that antidote and dropped dead on the floor, I think Sam would have just prodded him with his foot and said, "Hm. Interesting."

I'm currently subscribing to the theory that it's really Sam and all will be justified by a higher purpose

I'm leaning towards the "Sam has no soul" theory. Just a couple of weeks ago, Jensen said that he'd asked Sera to "give Sam his soul back." I don't know if he was speaking metaphorically or if that was an inadvertent spoiler. I'm kind of hoping that really isn't Sam since, as far as I'm concerned, no higher purpose could justify his behavior in this episode. If they want to go with the higher purpose idea then Sam should at least give a hint of being torn apart about what he had to do to Dean but OMG WHY AM I EVEN EXPECTING NUANCE HERE!?! The writers aren't gonna write it and JP isn't gonna portray it so how can I possibly ask for it?

As for Bobby, historically he takes Sam's side so why should next week be any different?

Well, you know, everybody IS so hard on Sam. Poor kid.

I wasted a substantial amount of S4 desperately hoping that Sam wasn't Sam. Until such time as I see it on screen I'm not propared to cling to even a vague shred of hope that that's what they'e up to this time :)

You're so judgmental and unforgiving. You, madam, are no Lisa Braeden.

It'll be interesting to see how Bobby reacts next week when he finds out what Sam did to Dean.

Slowly trawling back through the episode posts on this one, but I've got to say I'm dreading what is likely to be the inevitable "Suck it up, Princess, sociopathic family is supposed to make you miserable and lie to you like breathing and throw you to the wolves, doncha know, idjit!", phone call between these two. Yes, I'd like to know how and why - besides being the Producers' Fan Service Mouthpiece - Bobby can so easily be swayed by Sam and side with him when all logic says it's insane to.

No, Sam is doing nothing for Dean's happiness, and this last episode at least debunks the never-believable theory that Sam ditched Dean for a year for Dean's own happiness. We know now that Sam doesn't give a shit if Dean lives or dies, much less if he's happy; and he's been angling for the destruction of Dean's relationship with the Braedens since the end of 6:01.

But at the end of the day I can't really care why Sam's playing the latest version of treating Dean like crap because I know for a fact the whitewash excuse is out there - this time it's probably the "no soul" card, if Jensen wasn't speaking metaphorically. Sam will always get a free pass for his behavior, and it always gets to be blamed on someone/something else external to him - in this case, the removal of his soul, if that's what's going on. And that just aggravates the crap out of me because just once before the end of the series I'd like to see Sam have to own his own shit for a change, and maybe acknowledge just once that he's just not the nicest person in the world.

And if it's all for a higher purpose, I may just throw something at my flat screen because, yeah, I'm seeing no evidence that Sam is being torn up or pulled in any direction other than his own, possibly soulless, self-absorbed satisfaction.

Edited 2010-10-27 15:36 (UTC)

I'd love to imagine that SPN is going to provide some REAL explanation of why Sam let Dean remain ignorant of his escape from hell for a whole year. Because given Sam's recent behavior, it's completely impossible to believe that he wanted Dean to be happy.
I fucking HATED the whole "Sam just wanted Dean to be happy" nonsense so I'm fine with seeing it so thoroughly scrapped. If Sam thought for even one minute that his brother could be happy while thinking he was literally burning in hell, he's a sociopath. Friday's ep made it clear that yes, actually, he IS a sociopath so... yeah. Dean's happiness means nothing to him. I do think we're going to get explanations for new!Sam... not sure that we're going to like them, but the answer won't be Sam's overwhelming desire to see Dean happy.

I'd better not hear Bobby tell Dean that he must have imagined it because Sam's such a good kid and it's time for Dean to quit pissing and moaning about him.
Oh, Bobby, the most useless character on my TV. Of course he's going to take Sam's side. I think Sam could torture puppies in front of him and Bobby would find a way to twist it around until it was somehow Dean's fault.

Well, if they DO scrap the "Sam wanted Dean to be happy" business, then I hope they make it clear that Bobby was in on whatever's REALLY happened because the "we didn't tell you because you were so happy" didn't sound any more convincing coming from him than it did coming from Sam.

If Sam thought for even one minute that his brother could be happy while thinking he was literally burning in hell, he's a sociopath.
This.

SPN 6:05 II

I Know Really.

Re: I Know Really.

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject