SPN 6:13: Unforgiven

[oselle]

Much as I don't really remember the title, I don't really remember the episode. I found it very dull and all over the place. It was kind of trying to be Old Skool SPN with the MOTW stuff but then it was also trying to show us that Sam had done VERY BAD THINGS without his soul which frankly, didn't seem all that bad. Also, it seems to be important that we know that Sam banged a lot of broads when he didn't have a soul. OK, whatevs.

I guess the point was that Sam isn't supposed to be digging into his past because that's going to make "the wall" come tumbling down. We all know that's bound to happen so there isn't much suspense there. I'll admit the very end did startle me because I didn't think they'd "go there" already, but it would have been a whole lot more effective if the episode just closed with Sam seizing up on the floor instead of cutting away to some flaming CGI.

I've complained about these two writers before and the best thing I can say about this effort was that at least they didn't get an "F" on the characters like I think they have in the past. But it was still a pretty weak story. I'm sure there are plenty of writers out there who could do a better job than Messers. Dabb and Loflin. (Side note: WTF was up with Dean's comment about that woman giving Sam "cougar eyes?" That woman must have been in her early thirties, at most. Is any woman over 30 now considered a "cougar?" A stupid line by stupid men, rendered even more stupid by the fact that Dean himself hardly looks young enough to be calling that woman a cougar.)

On another note, I dreamt vividly that I was watching an episode of SPN where Sam and Dean were trapped in a town where all sorts of fairytales and childhood terrors had come to life. Because it was a dream, I was at home watching the episode... but simutaneously, it was real life, not a TV show, and I was living it. That was MY hometown. In the episode/dream, Dean has just yanked open a closet door to find...I don't recall, I think he was looking for a weapon or something. Immediately, the me who was sitting on the couch watching the show yelled out, "Not the closet, you idiot!" Because what kid doesn't know about The Closet Monster, right? Meanwhile the me who was living in the episode shouts at Dean, "No, not the closet!" And he turns around and goes, "What?!" Couch-Me and Episode-Me both yell, "The Closet Monster!" and Dean gets this Oh shit! look on his face and when he turns around there is indeed a Monster emerging from the closet...made out of all sorts of closet things. Like an enormous Sasquatch of coats and sheets and towels, which Dean then proceeded to beat to death with a stick or a poker or something. It was all pretty hilarious. God knows why I'd dream of a comedy episode because I don't even like them. But it was a lot more interesting to me than what someone actually got paid to write last night, LOL.

I also had an amazing dream about Jensen the other night but I'm keeping that to myself. It wasn't pornographic or anything it was just...too nice to share. Mine mine mine. Following up on my post about house-cleansing, I bought some smudge sticks at Whole Foods and I've been burning sage and cedar and mugwort (the last of the three is especially purported to bring on pleasant dreams). My apartment kind of smells like Cheech and Chong live here but I've been dreaming like crazy and most of the dreams have been really nice. So who knows, maybe it works.

ETA: Since I've been smudging, I've also been finding, um...dead flies. One yesterday morning on the bathroom sink, one this morning on the kitchen floor, and another one behind the wastebasket in the bathroom. It's the dead of winter, and a very cold snowy winter at that. Where are these flies coming from? I mean, I'm glad they're dead but...that's kind of creepy, isn't it?

Comments

[cannnit.livejournal.com]

I noticed you hadn`t much to say about the episode! Quite understandable.

I wish I had dreams about Jensen too. ;)

[oselle.livejournal.com]

Jensen hasn't popped up in my dreams in a long time, and the last time I dreamt about him, he was nasty. It was nice to see him again...being not-nasty.

[amber1960.livejournal.com]

What a wonderful SPN dream, I would so love to see that in an episode! You really must keep burning the incense if that is the kind of dreaming it encourages....I've not had any SPN dreams though apparently my husband had one with me and the boys in it (as he put it 'enjoying ourselves') which frankly, is just not fair!!
Oh and this episode - mmm, I didn't hate it but wasn't totally wowed by it either. And absolutely that CGI at the end was poor both in terms of how it was done but also impact..it really wasn't needed.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

There are some things better left unseen. I never liked that Dean-on-hooks tidbit at the end of the third season -- Dean's death and the knowledge that he was in hell would have been much more powerful without seeing that. Same thing this time around. I mean, a show like this can't really get away with showing anything truly hellish (this ain't HBO) so why not let the viewers use their imagination to fill in the blanks?

[amber1960.livejournal.com]

Yup, exactly - nothing they could show would ever be as bad or scary as what we could imagine - far better to go with suggestion at most - like this video does http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44TloMofnAU

[oselle.livejournal.com]

Do you think people from the CW ever see vids like these and are jealous of how good they are? This is ten times better than any promo the network has ever done.

[oxer12.livejournal.com]

That is a fantastic video. They used frames from "Constantine" for the hell part. Not like you can't cut in whatever you want, but anyone hoping to find that vision of Hell on SPN is going to be disappointed. ;)

[oselle.livejournal.com]

I recognized the Constantine bits -- one of my favorite movie visions of hell!

[mulder200.livejournal.com]

On another note, I dreamt vividly that I was watching an episode of SPN where Sam and Dean were trapped in a town where all sorts of fairytales and childhood terrors had come to life. Because it was a dream, I was at home watching the episode... but simutaneously, it was real life, not a TV show, and I was living it. That was MY hometown. In the episode/dream, Dean has just yanked open a closet door to find...I don't recall, I think he was looking for a weapon or something. Immediately, the me who was sitting on the couch watching the show yelled out, "Not the closet, you idiot!" Because what kid doesn't know about The Closet Monster, right? Meanwhile the me who was living in the episode shouts at Dean, "No, not the closet!" And he turns around and goes, "What?!" Couch-Me and Episode-Me both yell, "The Closet Monster!" and Dean gets this Oh shit! look on his face and when he turns around there is indeed a Monster emerging from the closet...made out of all sorts of closet things. Like an enormous Sasquatch of coats and sheets and towels, which Dean then proceeded to beat to death with a stick or a poker or something. It was all pretty hilarious. God knows why I'd dream of a comedy episode because I don't even like them. But it was a lot more interesting to me than what someone actually got paid to write last night, LOL.

I also had an amazing dream about Jensen the other night but I'm keeping that to myself. It wasn't pornographic or anything it was just...too nice to share. Mine mine mine.

Your dreams sound WAY more interesting than the show to be honest. Oh if only we could make them real.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

I wish!

[zatnikatel.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I wish I’d been watching your dream last night actually. The Closet Monster sounds awesome, and is just as much a part of folklore as skinwalkers etc. Though actually the flies are scarier, since I suffer from pteronarcophobia. I kid you not.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

I haven't written an SPN script for competition in years but that dream gave me ideas. Though at this point these characters (especially Sam) have so much extra and unmanageable baggage, I'm not sure if I could get away with a plain old MoTW spec.

The flies are dead, at least. Waterbugs are much worse, and I have those too (shudder).

[zatnikatel.livejournal.com]

I see your water bugs and raise you our 2-inch long Palmetto bugs, which have thigh muscles like Lance Armstrong.

While pondering just how underwhelmed I was by the episode [and God I don’t even really expect to be overwhelmed nowadays, just whelmed would be nice] I kept coming back to my initial feeling that the flashbacks were a waste of time because they didn’t tell us anything we didn’t already know. But then it occurred to me that yes, I know what Sam did as a viewer, but in the narrative he doesn’t… he only knows what he’s been told, and Cas might not know everything. So maybe the flashbacks do have a purpose in confronting Sam in a really visceral way with how he behaved when soulless, and that might have some relevance for his self-esteem/recovery, and for how this all plays out.

I was thinking about it in connection with the message that souls are important, and how that jars with the fact that both of the brothers have undervalued the importance of their own souls/humanity, and given them up, albeit for very good reasons: Dean with his deal and Sam when he chose the dark path to kill Lilith and then swan dived into Hell to cage Lucifer. It seems like Dean has realized this through his memories of Hell and the wider ramifications of his deal and that he likely he regrets it and wouldn’t do it again. But at the moment Sam doesn’t remember Hell, so maybe seeing these flashes of himself are the way to show him that his soul/humanity matter and are to be valued, and aren’t things that should be sacrificed whatever the reason might be. Perhaps that realization might turn out to have some relevance with the way this arc closes out.

Meh, I know it’s a reach… but I hate to think that episode was just filler at this stage in the series. I guess I’m still at the denial stage of mourning the show that was…

[oselle.livejournal.com]

The waterbug is the Yankee cousin of the palmetto bug. Let's not forget the Lance Armstrong thighs are covered with BIG SPINY HAIRS and that their exoskeleton is so armored you can hear them clatter around the room like a crab. OMG. I just grossed myself out.

he only knows what he’s been told, and Cas might not know everything. So maybe the flashbacks do have a purpose in confronting Sam in a really visceral way with how he behaved when soulless, and that might have some relevance for his self-esteem/recovery, and for how this all plays out.

If the writers are interested in using the flashbacks to confront Sam with his behavior, it's wrong place, wrong time, day late and a dollar short...pick your saying. Sam historically has brushed off his own behavior and its consequences. I found it really incongruous that Sam (in last week's episode) was so troubled by "what I did to you!" when he didn't have a soul, when he's never shown the slightest remorse about anything he did to Dean when he DID have a soul. I consider Sam far more in need of recovery and redemption for shit he did when he actually did still have a soul -- I don't hold him responsible for the things that "he" did when he didn't.

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

I'm just thinking how much any SPN ep would be improved if they actually listened to us shouting at the TV.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

INDEED.

[lsketch42.livejournal.com]

"but it would have been a whole lot more effective if the episode just closed with Sam seizing up on the floor instead of cutting away to some flaming CGI. "

Agreed....That CGI scene was really jarring, as was the whole 'Mother' scene in the last episode. Subtlety is not really this group of writer's specialty. They need to save the money and buy back some classic rock.

Also:

"In the episode/dream, Dean has just yanked open a closet door to find...I don't recall, I think he was looking for a weapon or something. Immediately, the me who was sitting on the couch watching the show yelled out, "Not the closet, you idiot!"

This made me LOL.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

They need to save the money and buy back some classic rock.

Seriously. When you watch Seasons One and Two, it's amazing how effective the music was at establishing the show...sadly, they must not have been able to purchase those song rights for syndication, because if you ever watch SPN in the cable reruns, some of those classic tunes just aren't there anymore and the whole episode feels "off."

[oxer12.livejournal.com]

See, and I'm thinking that the 2 episodes since the hiatus have been better than the whole first half put together, that's how much I hated the first half of the season!

Mmmm, Jensen dreams...

[oselle.livejournal.com]

I don't think they've been that bad, I just think they've been kind of boring. This week's especially.

[bonwriter.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't necessarily blame the writers for the "cougar eyes" line. I bet they wrote it with an older woman in mind, but TPTB decided to cast more of a hot young babe in the role -- since that's what producers and casting directors always default to.

[oselle.livejournal.com]

Aw, these writers have been with the show more than long enough to know exactly what kinds of women the producers cast...and to be honest, I'm sure that if they wrote "older woman" in the script they actually did mean someone who was about thirty. "Hot young babe" status ends somewhere around twenty-five.

On a different but related note, they really need to stop casting these lookalike actresses. They've been doing it for years but it was especially problematic to have so many of them in one episode. The story was dull enough without finding it nearly impossible to distinguish one brunette from the other.

[morganslady.livejournal.com]

You have flies, I have these tiny mothlike insects. I keep vacuuming dead flying things from the window sills,and the next day more dead flying things. What's up with this???

You are correct about the cougar comment. I was shaking my head thinking either they needed an older actress or another line..

[oselle.livejournal.com]

I get tiny winged bugs sometimes that look like incredibly miniaturized wasps but I think they are some sort of ant.

[dodger-sister.livejournal.com]

That is actually a great dream and I kind of wish they would do a childhood monsters ep of SPN. The closet monster in my hosue was not made of clothes things though - my closet had an entrance to the attic in it, so my closet monster was made of garbage, because I was convinced that was what we kept in the attic, garbage.

Jensen dreams of any kind are a win!

[oselle.livejournal.com]

A closet with an ATTIC entrance? That's a double-whammy. Reminds me of Paranormal Activity. Brrr.

The Jensen dream I had a little while ago where he was mysteriously snowbound in my apartment and he was on his cell and like a dork I asked him if he was texting Jared and he fixed me with a withering look and said, "Why would I be texting Jared?" and I instantly knew that he was actually texting his wife to tell her he was snowbound in some idiot's gross apartment in Queens was most certainly NOT made of win.

[dodger-sister.livejournal.com]

J is still refusing to watch PA because of how much that movie freaked you out. ;)

That is true - Jensen was uncool in that dream. But mute the sound on it and Jensen Ackles is still sitting in your living room, right?

BTW, when J was on the phone with you the other day, I didn't actually want her to get off and feed me. I just wanted to say 'hi' to you when she was done talking. I think my mom is writing Taylor/Kirk Gilmore Girls slash. I'll tell you about it next time we talk. <3

[oselle.livejournal.com]

But mute the sound on it and Jensen Ackles is still sitting in your living room, right?

Yes, Jensen Ackles was sitting in my living room giving me a crushing "You're an asshole" look. You can't turn down the sound on THAT.

I think Jensen's withering facial expression in that dream came to me courtesy of the blooper reel from Season One's "Provenance," where that Pocahontas girl keeps flubbing her lines and giggling while Jensen is sitting in the background of the scene looking more irritated by the second. LOL, I'd never want anyone as pretty as Jensen pissed off at me.

Taylor/Kirk Gilmore Girls slash

No. Just no.

[kiltiebum.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it was a tad unforgettable, I'll admit. Although the insta-seizure at the end made up for it, but then not the CGI, Sam-on-fire bit. Even on a bad day, when writers block hits me like a freight train, I could *still* have conjured up some other (economic) vision of Sam's suffering in the pit. But hey...

[oselle.livejournal.com]

There was no need to see ANY of Sam's suffering in the pit. The insta-seizure alone would have been far more dramatic.

[salty-catfish.livejournal.com]

Those godawful sfx made me throw up my hands in despair. There was no reason whatsoever for them to give us this valuable look into Sam's head - let him just have a seizure, it's way scarier and creepier. Plus it wouldn't undermine everything I liked about the S4 non-portrayal of hell. (Or, you know, make it actual fire that sears of the flesh. I wouldn't want to see that, but it would be pretty horrific.)

[oselle.livejournal.com]

it's way scarier and creepier

Have these people learned nothing good from fanfic?