oselle | Heart go Pitty-Pat

Because this is exactly how I felt about Future!Castiel's unswerving devotion to Dean. It just goes to show how much Misha was able to convey in that episode, even without having to spell it out in so many words.

Yes, yes, and YES! Not only do I believe that Misha is a Dean!girl and a Jensen!girl, but I think he's also a pretty firm believer in the "profound bond", long before Edlund (again, it's Edlund) even specified it. Apparently one of the responses he gave at the recent Barcelona con to a question about where he wants Cas's story to go next year was something about wanting to cry in Dean's lap, or something like that. Oh yeah, he gets it. He's down with it. Hee!

"The End"...a great episode? Or THE GREATEST episode??

With that line, I'm going with GREATEST! ;D

Edited 2011-06-18 02:00 (UTC)

something about wanting to cry in Dean's lap

YES PLEASE.

With that line, I'm going with GREATEST!

It is the greatest. Hands down.

Wholeheartedly agree, The End is a mini masterpiece...and would give anything for it to be the basis of a Dean/Cas spin off. Everything about the episode is perfect, it's Supernatural but on another level.

There was so much potential there for years of stories, but it would have required a tremendous amount of committed effort. If Kripke hadn't insisted on sticking to his "Swan Song" guns, we could have had a truly evil Sam, a real apocalypse and some unbelievably kickassery from Dean and Castiel. They had the chance to make this show as complex and challenging as Battlestar Galactica, and I think another team of writers would have gone for it, but this one clearly didn't want to do anything that risky.

The funny thing is I had a weird sense that they were going to go down that route for season 7. I actually thought that because Sam had been pulverized in Hell for all eternity, he would turn evil once the wall had fallen and season 7 would be Dean and Cas together fighting against Sam....I know a pipe dream right? Clearly I had too much faith in the writers actually being creative and brave, but then this WAS when I thought having Kripke back would mean a brave new world for SPN as a response to Gamble's lame efforts (after 6x22 not so much). Anyhow, who would have thought it would turn out to sorta come true but with Cas instead, which while following the same story idea isn't going to work because of the character's dynamics.

I just can't see Dean and Sam bonding together anymore, them against the world...hmmm, the tank has run dry and the writers have exhausted their relationship. Plus as already mentioned, any love from Sam now just comes across as hollow, or fake. On the other hand we have this intense connection between Dean and Cas who I can really see clinging onto each other, them against the world...hell yeah!, because they are still getting to know each other - their relationship is still fresh. Plus there's their undeniable love for each other that runs through every scene. ;)

So, story wise, and show wise, it would have been better for Sam to turn evil (once and for all) and Dean and Cas to join forces but as you said "this one clearly didn't want to do anything that risky." So they thought Cas was a safer option, and they are clearly not bothered about alienating the Cas fans...who are what, less influential or less important than the Sam fans?

I know that Sam is technically one of the leads, okay - but JP likes to play evil and with his low level of commitment in his performance these days, especially since his precious chance to shine as Souless Sam was cut short because neither he or the writers couldn't work it, I couldn't see him wanting to do another season of normalSam and still can't imagine how they are going to keep his interest in this for another year.

Referring to what you said below "he most often looks bored or disengaged when he's supposed to be caring about Dean or about anything other than himself. Even his apologies sound hollow and sulky, like a little kid who's been made to apologize for something he's really not sorry for at all." So I guess he'll be phoning it in even more next season..or as usual the writers will make Dean be all about Sam and Sam will just take it, whilst being all about himself.

*Sigh* The intensity of Dean and Cas v the one sided bored relationship of Sam and Dean - I don't care about actor status, creatively the first one would have been gold, and even JP would have been happy.

That should be could work it btw - oops!

Gamble's gushing about Butch Cassidy stuff, combined with her downgrading of Castiel and obvious disdain for audience opinion about that, have more or less destroyed whatever minimal hopes I had for Season 7. I have no idea how much Kripke or Edlund will even be involved -- their titles have supposedly changed, which Gamble says is just a contractual thing, but I don't know what that means. Will Gamble be more in charge, or less?

The intensity of Dean and Cas v the one sided bored relationship of Sam and Dean - I don't care about actor status, creatively the first one would have been gold, and even JP would have been happy.

A story where Sam is really the antagonist vs. Dean and Castiel has a lot of dynamic potential but they're never, ever going to go there. I do think it would have alienated the part of the audience that still wants to see Dean and Sam as equal partners again but I just feel like that ship sailed so long ago that there's no reclaiming it, and they really need to seek out new waters. I just don't see this "outlaw" story having any promise whatsoever, especially if they approach it as haphazardly as they did the "noir" theme this year.

There was so much potential there for years of stories, but it would have required a tremendous amount of committed effort. If Kripke hadn't insisted on sticking to his "Swan Song" guns, we could have had a truly evil Sam, a real apocalypse and some unbelievably kickassery from Dean and Castiel. They had the chance to make this show as complex and challenging as Battlestar Galactica,

This, this!

Exactly what I was thinking when I finally saw The End, a glimmer of an AU that could have presented so many interesting possibilities for the show and allowed it to evolve instead of constantly rehashing variations on the same Sam is he or isn't he plots. Would have taken guts to actually take him all the way to evil with Dean and Cas hanging onto each other in a truly apocalyptic world, trying and maybe or maybe not succeeding to either redeem Sam or end Sam.

I had the same thought when Sam strangled Dean in that hotel room, it was an inkling of what could have happened if they had gone this route.

I have still seen only a handful of S6, and not all of those episodes in their entirety, but if they were going to go the route of soulless Sam anyway, it would have worked so much better in a The End kind of universe than the lame out of left field S6 plots and the myriad hoops they had to jump through in S6 to explain why Sam was the way he was and how they were going to save him etc etc.

And Gamble could've still had her souped up Sam on steroids.

And Gamble could've still had her souped up Sam on steroids.

Going this route would have offered so much possibility to everyone, that as Season 5 began to wind down to its close, I honestly thought this was where they were heading. Alas, fat chance. Look, I understand it would have been a really risky move that might have alienated some of the viewers, and it may have had some cost implications, but wow, it would have been so worth it.

Heart go Pitty-Pat

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